I'm in Orlando, Florida, at the Rifqa Bary hearing. Tom Trento of the Florida Security Council, Pamela Geller of Atlas Shrugs and I held a press conference outside the courtroom a little while ago, for a skeptical and sometimes hostile press. The press conference was disrupted several times by Muhammad Lutfi, an Ohio Muslim with connections to the Hamas-linked Council on American-Islamic Relations; he has clearly taken a great interest in this case.
We explained about the jihadist connections of the Noor mosque, about Islamic apostasy law, and about Islamic honor killing. The mainstream media flocked to Lutfi, because he was telling them what they want to hear, but he was lying openly about Islamic apostasy law, denying that Muhammad had said, "If anyone changes his religion, kill him," and when I pointed out that this was in a hadith in Bukhari, the collection of traditions of Muhammad that Muslims consider most reliable, he denied that also.
I'm in an overflow courtroom now, with the proceedings from the main courtroom on closed-circuit video. Rifqa is in the courtroom now, and it will all be beginning soon. I'll keep up with what I can here, but my laptop is running out of juice, so I may not be able to liveblog even though laptops are allowed in here. In any case, I'll keep you posted. Pamela is in the main courtroom and I'm sure she will have extensive coverage.
I've met many heroic people here -- converts from Islam and others who have come out to show their support for this courageous and threatened girl, whom every lover of freedom should be supporting.
-- We are now embarked. Rifqa's parents, Mohamed and Aysha Bary, are both present via phone. Their lawyers are in the courtroom. They are discussing a date for a mediation hearing. The judge is explaining that there are "issues beyond what the facts are" -- jurisdictional issues and others. And they are sorting out the status of the mother's attorneys; the family clearly has lawyered up since the first hearing. They are apparently no longer "indigent," as they had previously claimed.
The Orlando Sentinel has put in a notice of appearance, which would give them notice of certain documents in the case; Rifqa's lawyer wonders who provided confidential information to the Sentinel so that they knew to do so. Good question. The Sentinel rep is arguing that historically when proceedings have been closed, the media has been given access to documents that are otherwise sealed to the public. Mohamed and Aysha Bary's lawyer is arguing that since this case has been "blown out of proportion" on the Internet (heh), the Sentinel should have access to confidential documents, presumably to set the record straight.
My battery is running out!
The court has denied the Sentinel's request, but the judge is assuring the media that in any issues related to closing future hearings he would allow them to be heard.
A representative of the Florida Department of Law Enforcement is present and has a report. He is, perhaps significantly, sitting with the lawyers for the parents. At the adversarial press conference reporters were shouting that law enforcement had investigated and found that Rifqa was not bat any risk in returning to her family in Ohio; this perhaps was what they were referring to.
One of Rifqa's lawyers is saying that they were given no opportunity to be present when Rifqa was interviewed by law enforcement. Neither her attorney nor her guardian ad litem were present, which seems highly irregular. The other side responds that because Rifqa is not a suspect but a victim, she had no right to have counsel present.
Alas, my battery is running out; must shut down. Will take notes on paper and update you asap.
UPDATING from Blackberry now, as long as it holds out. Now, over a question regarding mediation, the lawyers have approached the bench, and the mics are off.
Now they're back. The judge is saying that there are enough attorneys in the court room (and there are many), so he is not inclined to appoint an atty ad litem for Rifqa, as she has private counsel.
Now they're discussing a gag order for the case. The judge is allowing the Sentinel rep to argue against the gag order. The Sentinel guy is saying that gag orders are for jury trials, but in this case there is no jury, so no one influenced by coverage will be making the decisions. He says that gag orders are to keep people from being prejudiced as to the case, and so no gag order is needed here.
The guardian ad litem is saying that Rifqa understands why a gag order is needed, and says that many times she and others connected to the case have been distraught by the coverage. And looking at the Sentinel's coverage, that is understandable.
Rifqa, says her lawyer, says that "This case is not about me, but about thousands like me," but understands why the gag order is needed.
Now the parents' attorney is attacking John Stemberger, Rifqa's attorney, for his hypocrisy. He says that Stemberger has been lying and attacking the Ohio mosque and Muslims, and now he wants a gag order. He is saying that a gag order would be saying that people can use the media for their benefit and that they would have no right to respond. He is saying that Stemberger's report on the Ohio mosque was based on lies from right wing sources and had no value.
The FDLE guy then contrasted Stemberger's supposedly baseless report with the FDLE report that says she is in no danger. Then Rifqa's guardian ad litem asked that he be removed from the court, as he released material from the FDLE report after they just sealed it. They went to the bench to talk that over.
The parents' lawyer is attacking Stemberger and the Lorenzes for publicizing the case. He also earlier mentioned an attack on Islam and Muslims.
The judge is saying that both sides have gotten plenty of media coverage. He agrees that the more media attention Rifqa gets, the less safe she is. He grants the gag order, but only the attorneys. They are to discuss only procedural issues with the media. The parents' lawyer says English is their 2nd language, and he is gagging people who can speak for them. Judge replies that it is not his job to provide interpreters for people who want to talk to the media -- and that they can get other people to speak for them. After the case is resolved, he said, you can write your novel or produce your miniseries or do whatever you want to do.
Now they're discussing Rifqa's citizenship status. And now on to the question of jurisdiction. The mother's new attorney has just filed a new motion saying this court has no jurisdiction. The guardian ad litem says that has already been decided, and you don't get 2 bites of the apple. Now the parents' lawyer says that Ohio Child Protective Services won't file a case because they don't think she is in danger, but FL only has jurisdiction because Ohio has not filed a case, setting up a catch 22. He says that if they have to, they will file a case in Ohio charging that Rifqa is an unruly delinquent. The judge says essentially that if another case is filed, jurisdiction will be reconsidered.
Now they're discussing procedures regarding visitation rights. She has had supervised contact with her brother. The department (not sure of what) is seeking to limit visitation with Pastor Lorenz and his wife. Now the parents' lawyer is saying that the Lorenzes and their children and the Global Revolution Church should be restricted from seeing the child. He says that because of the gag on attorneys, Stemberger, who has a habit of grandstanding, will use the church to do his "dirty work."
Stemberger says Elahi -- the parents' lawyer -- is the one who is grandstanding, and that he has provided accurate information. He says that the Lorenzes' children are Rifqa's friends and provide her comfort. The judge says he will allow them to continue to visit Rifqa. Parents' lawyer says Mohamed Bary has not lost his parental rights, and he has a say in who sees his child. He says the Lorenzes hid Rifqa for two and a half weeks while Ohio was looking for her. The judge says that no allegations have actually been made against the Lorenzes' children. And he adds that even her own siblings should not be discussing this case.
The parents' lawyer says that mediation will be useless. "I'm trying to help the court" by saying this, he says. The judge says that he doesn't see how he is helping the court by complaining that mediation won't work. They agree to set a date for mediation. Also the guardian ad litem asks that the child start counseling, and that should later expand to family counseling. Some say she has already started it. The judge suggests medication, and the guardian says Rifqa objects to that. One of Rifqa's attorneys wants to know the persepective of the counselor.
The parents' attorney wants the judge to appoint an attorney ad litem for Rifqa. He says Stemberger is agenda-driven. The judge says he should file a motion to that effect, but that Rifqa wants Stemberger and he will respect that. He says that it seems that Elahi wants a new attorney who will have a different view from Stemberger's of what is in the child's best interests. But he will not appoint one now.
September 29 -- next hearing.
Posted by Robert at September 3, 2009 2:34 PM
Visits
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..Israeli Shekel Exchange
September 3, 2009
At the Rifqa Bary hearing, Orlando, Florida
I'm in Orlando, Florida, at the Rifqa Bary hearing. TomTrento of the Florida Security Council , Pamela Geller of Atlas Shrugs and I held a press conference outside the courtroom a little while ago, for a skeptical and sometimes hostile press. The press conference was disrupted several times by Muhammad Lutfi, an Ohio Muslim with connections to the Hamas-linked Council on American-Islamic Relations; he has clearly taken a great interest in this case.
We explained about the jihadist connections of theNoor mosque , about Islamic apostasy law, and about Islamic honor killing. The mainstream media flocked to Lutfi, because he was telling them what they want to hear, but he was lying openly about Islamic apostasy law, denying that Muhammad had said, "If anyone changes his religion, kill him," and when I pointed out that this was in a hadith in Bukhari, the collection of traditions of Muhammad that Muslims consider most reliable, he denied that also.
I'm in an overflow courtroom now, with the proceedings from the main courtroom on closed-circuit video. Rifqa is in the courtroom now, and it will all be beginning soon. I'll keep up with what I can here, but my laptop is running out of juice, so I may not be able to liveblog even though laptops are allowed in here. In any case, I'll keep you posted. Pamela is in the main courtroom and I'm sure she will have extensive coverage.
I've met many heroic people here -- converts from Islam and others who have come out to show their support for this courageous and threatened girl, whom every lover of freedom should be supporting.
-- We are now embarked. Rifqa's parents, Mohamed and Aysha Bary, are both present via phone. Their lawyers are in the courtroom. They are discussing a date for a mediation hearing. The judge is explaining that there are "issues beyond what the facts are" -- jurisdictional issues and others. And they are sorting out the status of the mother's attorneys; the family clearly has lawyered up since the first hearing. They are apparently no longer "indigent," as they had previously claimed.
The Orlando Sentinel has put in a notice of appearance, which would give them notice of certain documents in the case; Rifqa's lawyer wonders who provided confidential information to the Sentinel so that they knew to do so. Good question. The Sentinel rep is arguing that historically when proceedings have been closed, the media has been given access to documents that are otherwise sealed to the public. Mohamed and Aysha Bary's lawyer is arguing that since this case has been "blown out of proportion"on the Internet (heh), the Sentinel should have access to confidential documents, presumably to set the record straight.
My battery is running out!
The court has denied the Sentinel's request, but the judge is assuring the media that in any issues related to closing future hearings he would allow them to be heard.
A representative of the Florida Department of Law Enforcement is present and has a report. He is, perhaps significantly, sitting with the lawyers for the parents. At the adversarial press conference reporters were shouting that law enforcement had investigated and found that Rifqa was not bat any risk in returning to her family in Ohio; this perhaps was what they were referring to.
One of Rifqa's lawyers is saying that they were given no opportunity to be present when Rifqa was interviewed by law enforcement. Neither her attorney nor her guardian ad litem were present, which seems highly irregular. The other side responds that because Rifqa is not a suspect but a victim, she had no right to have counsel present.
Alas, my battery is running out; must shut down. Will take notes on paper and update you asap.
UPDATING from Blackberry now, as long as it holds out. Now, over a question regarding mediation, the lawyers have approached the bench, and the mics are off.
Now they're back. The judge is saying that there are enough attorneys in the court room (and there are many), so he is not inclined to appoint an atty ad litem for Rifqa, as she has private counsel.
Now they're discussing a gag order for the case. The judge is allowing the Sentinel rep to argue against the gag order. The Sentinel guy is saying that gag orders are for jury trials, but in this case there is no jury, so no one influenced by coverage will be making the decisions. He says that gag orders are to keep people from being prejudiced as to the case, and so no gag order is needed here.
The guardian ad litem is saying that Rifqa understands why a gag order is needed, and says that many times she and others connected to the case have been distraught by the coverage. And looking at the Sentinel's coverage, that is understandable.
Rifqa, says her lawyer, says that "This case is not about me, but about thousands like me," but understands why the gag order is needed.
Now the parents' attorney is attacking John Stemberger, Rifqa's attorney, for his hypocrisy. He says that Stemberger has been lying and attacking the Ohio mosque and Muslims, and now he wants a gag order. He is saying that a gag order would be saying that people can use the media for their benefit and that they would have no right to respond. He is saying that Stemberger's report on the Ohio mosque was based on lies from right wing sources and had no value.
The FDLE guy then contrasted Stemberger's supposedly baseless report with the FDLE report that says she is in no danger. Then Rifqa's guardian ad litem asked that he be removed from the court, as he released material from the FDLE report after they just sealed it. They went to the bench to talk that over.
The parents' lawyer is attacking Stemberger and the Lorenzes for publicizing the case. He also earlier mentioned an attack on Islam and Muslims.
The judge is saying that both sides have gotten plenty of media coverage. He agrees that the more media attention Rifqa gets, the less safe she is. He grants the gag order, but only the attorneys. They are to discuss only procedural issues with the media. The parents' lawyer says English is their 2nd language, and he is gagging people who can speak for them. Judge replies that it is not his job to provide interpreters for people who want to talk to the media -- and that they can get other people to speak for them. After the case is resolved, he said, you can write your novel or produce your miniseries or do whatever you want to do.
Now they're discussing Rifqa's citizenship status. And now on to the question of jurisdiction. The mother's new attorney has just filed a new motion saying this court has no jurisdiction. The guardian ad litem says that has already been decided, and you don't get 2 bites of the apple. Now the parents' lawyer says thatOhio Child Protective Services won't file a case because they don't think she is in danger, but FL only has jurisdiction because Ohio has not filed a case, setting up a catch 22. He says that if they have to, they will file a case in Ohio charging that Rifqa is an unruly delinquent. The judge says essentially that if another case is filed, jurisdiction will be reconsidered.
Now they're discussing procedures regarding visitation rights. She has had supervised contact with her brother. The department (not sure of what) is seeking to limit visitation with Pastor Lorenz and his wife. Now the parents' lawyer is saying that the Lorenzes and their children and the Global Revolution Church should be restricted from seeing the child. He says that because of the gag on attorneys, Stemberger, who has a habit of grandstanding, will use the church to do his "dirty work."
Stemberger says Elahi -- the parents' lawyer -- is the one who is grandstanding, and that he has provided accurate information. He says that the Lorenzes' children are Rifqa's friends and provide her comfort. The judge says he will allow them to continue to visit Rifqa. Parents' lawyer says Mohamed Bary has not lost his parental rights, and he has a say in who sees his child. He says the Lorenzes hid Rifqa for two and a half weeks while Ohio was looking for her. The judge says that no allegations have actually been made against the Lorenzes' children. And he adds that even her own siblings should not be discussing this case.
The parents' lawyer says that mediation will be useless. "I'm trying to help the court" by saying this, he says. The judge says that he doesn't see how he is helping the court by complaining that mediation won't work. They agree to set a date for mediation. Also the guardian ad litem asks that the child start counseling, and that should later expand to family counseling. Some say she has already started it. The judge suggests medication, and the guardian says Rifqa objects to that. One of Rifqa's attorneys wants to know the persepective of the counselor.
The parents' attorney wants the judge to appoint an attorney ad litem for Rifqa. He says Stemberger is agenda-driven. The judge says he should file a motion to that effect, but that Rifqa wants Stemberger and he will respect that. He says that it seems that Elahi wants a new attorney who will havea different view from Stemberger's of what is in the child's best interests. But he will not appoint one now.
September 29 -- next hearing.
Posted by Robert at September 3, 2009 2:34 PM
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Comment
Fantastic work ! I am hypnotized, speechless and mesmerized !
Thank you Robert.
Posted by: Alexander MünchThank you Pamela.